In this highly energetic episode, Shae Bynes, Founder of Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur shares how God broke into her life and changed it’s course forever!
Scott Ritzheimer
Hello, hello and welcome. Welcome to the latest episode of the secrets of the high demand coach podcast. And I’m here with yet another high demand coach. And that is the fantastic the fabulous. Mr. Shea Bynes. I’m so glad that you’re here today. I met Shae, when we actually had an opportunity on her podcast. I’m trying to remember. Was it Dr. Joe? That connected us? I believe?
Shae Bynes
I think so. I’m not even sure.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yes, it was one of those things that was like nine different degrees of separation. collapse into one absolutely incredible conversation. I had so much fun with Shay on the podcast that when we decided to launch one here at scale architects, she was one of the very first people that I asked and because she is one in high demand, it took us a little while to get the recording, but to massively generous, because she hasn’t done a brand new show like this in a while because of her schedule, but was so generous with her time. So che thank you so much for being here. I’d love to. Yeah, I’d love for you to share just a little bit about your story, because I know it’s amazing, and how you got into doing what it is you do today.
Shae Bynes
Sure, pretty wild how I ended up doing what I do now, because it was never really in my intents, you know, my background was in technology as a software engineer, and then a project project manager back in my corporate days. But I had what some who are listening will will really relate to this. But I have what I would call a a very divine interruption in my life where I really felt like God was calling me out of corporate career. And so I left having been, you know, a real estate investor business owner on the side, but doing this corporate career, and I left and that was gosh, I was in 2010. And after doing that, I started to do a little bit of consulting in the real estate investing space. But then I had another divine interruption in my life two years later, that led to the work that I do now, which is Kingdom driven entrepreneur. So we’re working with believers all over the globe, Christ followers who desire to do business in partnership with God for some that’s an odd concept, but it’s a beautiful one. And it’s been the work of the last decade will be 10 years old, in just a couple of months. And so it has been such a delightful I call it the wild and crazy and amazing adventure with God. And that’s what it’s been. So I never imagined my right now, but it’s been really a blessing really has.
Scott Ritzheimer
That’s fantastic. So tell us a little bit about it. What What would you say some of the most important work that you do a kingdom driven entrepreneur.
Shae Bynes
Yeah, so everything kind of falls into inspire, teach mentor and advise. So on the Inspire side, we do that through the stories that’s through the podcast through media to show people, this is what it’s like this is what’s possible when you do business with God. So that’s the Inspire side teach, we do that through a variety of just kind of self paced courses, mentoring, which is one of my favorite parts through our igniters mentoring community, as well as a community that I directly mentor, which is called Kingdom catalyst. And then the advisement side is actually relatively new and kingdom driven entrepreneur. We started the advising side a little over a year ago. And that’s when we come, you know, alongside, you know, one on one with business owners and really advise them, some of the ones who’ve been more seasoned, and they really feel like God’s called them to a much larger vision. There’s some things they’re needing to pivot, there’s some things are looking to grow and expanded. They really want some wise advice and counsel as they walk that out. And so that’s kind of the landscape of what we do from the Inspire, teach, mentor and advise.
Scott Ritzheimer
Yeah, that’s fascinating. Now you bring up a point, and that is this idea of coaching and advising for folks who are arguably massively successful, right. And it’s actually through that success that they’ve created new opportunities. But the thing that never ceases to amaze me and I would even say fascinate me is this idea that, you know, each time we achieve something, it unlocks another opportunity, which leaves us basically completely out of our depth all over again,
Shae Bynes
all over again. I call that going from glory to glory,
Scott Ritzheimer
because that’s the most optimistic way I’ve heard that describe. I love it. I love it. Now, what I’d like to do those drill in on what are some of the challenges that again, these very successful leaders are facing that you tend to tackle head on with them?
Shae Bynes
Yeah, well, just as a point of clarification, and where you serve people all the way from the beginning of they’re aspiring business owners all the way through season. So even though the advising is for the season, but we’re you know, we’re working with a variety of people who are in startup phase all the way through really seasoned but some of the but if you do want me to only deal with the more seasoned ones for this.
Scott Ritzheimer
Let’s actually play around with that a little bit because I really like one of the things that that I think a lot of folks in our profession do wrong is this kind of one size fits all right I’m a coach. And then they either like I can coach you with anything, or I do this one specific thing. And it’s supposed to work for everybody. Yeah. And I don’t think either of those extremes are really the right way to go. And so I love the idea that you’re, you’re recognizing there’s these different stages, and you’re offering different things along the way. So if we could just kind of quickly highlight maybe the biggest challenge that you’re facing and kind of the early startup or pre startup mode, and then some of the ways that you help. And then let’s just kind of do that for each of those.
Shae Bynes
Sure. Yeah, absolutely. So when you think about the aspiring those, the one who’s about to start or just started, a lot of times, it is a matter of having the faith to begin, because there’s so many questions, they have more questions than answers. And so it is. So it’s really, it is a faith journey, we’re saying you don’t have all the answers. And that’s okay. That’s literally what faith is, it’s taking a step without being able to see all the steps that are coming ahead. And so for beginning beginners, it’s all about momentum. It’s like taking one step after the other based off of what you can see, based off of what you can understand based off of you know, what’s been on your heart, what’s been on your mind concerning that. What step can you take now, and just knowing that you can you can trust while you do the walk, because there’s going to be course corrections, additional information that comes as you go. But if you’re sitting stagnated, you don’t you’re not providing anything for their beat for there to be feedback. And inside and, you know, course correction along the way, as long as you’re standing still. So a lot of times that focus for the new, the brand new one who’s kind of like pre revenue or pre profit, or they haven’t started yet is just helping them to grow in the confidence to build momentum, the biggest problem thinking that you need to know way more than you actually
Scott Ritzheimer
It’s true. It’s so so true. I’ve told folks on more than one occasion, it’s a lot easier to turn a moving ship. If you get stuck standing still. And it’s just the worst possible one. So Okay, excellent. I love that. And I couldn’t agree more. You know that that momentum is both tangible and intangible. It’s a it’s one of the things you know, when you have it. And you know what, when you don’t, we don’t always know it, the next thing? Is this going to create it, but I think you’re right, in that it’s those small steps, what’s the very next thing going going and managing our momentum along the way, way, and it’s wonderful having someone like you in the corner to really help in those low spots? So what would you kind of how would you describe the next stage?
Shae Bynes
So your next stage is someone who has maybe they’ve been at it a while, I won’t put a timeframe on it, but they’ve been on a route, they’re generating revenue. But now it’s like, okay, I’m doing okay, this business isn’t big enough to sustain my family yet, but I’m doing okay. And I’m looking to grow. And they actually have information and insight in which to make it but a lot of times, the challenge at this stage is that the thing that you see, and the stages that you feel like you need to make you feel like I don’t have the resources fully yet to do the things that I feel like I need to do. And so how do we navigate that? You know, and it’s funny, because each of these stages requires faith, like every single one of these phases. So then it becomes the conversation around that is like, okay, so you may see a vision of the future, you may see what needs to come. But what steps can you take toward that now, even if it’s a smaller step, I’ll give you an example. When it comes to hiring. And I remember what the step was like for me, but it was like, oh, we need to make a hire. But I can’t hire a full time person right now. But But I need to have additional support. And so what it looked like it was, well, how can I take a step in faith towards this? Well, you know what, I can start with someone with way less hours, let me get a contractor, you can work just just a few hours a month. And then we then a few more hours a month, and then a few hours a week, you know, that was the process. And a lot of people it’s like they want you to go all in, because I really feel like I need this right now. But you know what, there’s steps that you can take while you’re building too. So it’s really helping people to kind of discern what’s actually necessary from them actually saying, you have all you need right now. But you just need to steward this and show some faith in a few areas that will help you build momentum for you to be able to do the full thing of what you’re seeing, you know, so that tends to be that conversation. And then for the one who’s more seasoned, and they’ve been at this for a while, we run into a lot of people where all of a sudden they feel like God’s calling them into an expansion, or something that feels like a very dramatic pivot. And so for them, whether it’s an expansion, or whether it’s a pivot, they have a whole new set of challenges to walk through, because they’re saying, especially the ones who feel like it’s something that’s a bit new. It’s like, I have all this experience over here. And now I feel like I’m supposed to be doing this. And so what does that look like? How do I make that transition? How do I What’s the bridge? What is that process? Like, you know? And then for those who are expansion, going back to that comment about this glory to glory thing, it’s like, okay, I can have what have I learned from all these stages? And what God revealed to me and all these stages? What What’s the goodness that I can dig the treasures from these previous seasons that will help to me realize that I’m equipped for this next phase? You know, what does that look like? It’s interesting, because a lot of times people think that what they’re in need of its tactics. Yeah, so focused on tactics of I just have all the tactics, but I gotta tell you doing this pretend here, the tactics are the easiest part. The biggest challenge time after time relates to mindset, your heart posture, like those that consistently the biggest challenge. And then, you know, Scott, we add on top of that, we’re doing business in partnership with God. So now you got a bunch of folks that are just like, Oh, but I don’t know if this is what God’s leading me or is this me? Is this my ideas? Like, what is this? You know? So we add a whole nother dimension of things that people start to feel, you know, some anxiety around was like, no, no, no, that should be the opposite of that, because you’re doing business with the Prince of Peace. So let’s, let’s walk that out. Right. And so that’s what it’s been like in various phases. But time after time, Scott, the tactics are the easiest part. And many people don’t believe that, but it’s the truth.
Scott Ritzheimer
It’s so true. And I think it’s one of the differences between reading a book, or you know, going to a workshop or watching a YouTube video, you can pick the tactics up, right? But when you bring someone alongside you, right, if you’re going to take this step, and bring in a coach, bring in a consultant, or advisor, or someone to walk with you, there, they’re going to go after the real stuff. More often than not, you know, that real stuff is the four inches between your ears, you know, it’s and so and, you know, and, and your heart, you can’t get out of it. But it’s in here, when we’re constantly looking to change things out there. Yeah, we’re looking for solutions out there.
Shae Bynes
That’s right. And those solutions are there. But even when you have them when the other stuffs not, right, it’s like, it might work for a time, but then you’re gonna be challenged yet again. And so it’s so working on that aspect of things and helping people to kind of grow and, you know, and have the confidence from that perspective, is really vital. And I mean, I’ve worked with people from startup to multi million dollar businesses with, you know, expansion on ROI. And it’s a lot of the same things just with a different context. Yeah, different contexts, different challenges, different dreams, different vision, but a lot of the similar challenges.
Scott Ritzheimer
It’s the same person, you know, yeah, it’s the same person going through every one of those stages. And yes, it’s easy to look at. I remember the first time I was working with $100 million organization, and I was just, like, starstruck, I was like, why am I here? You know, like, I’ve done this thing, but not that big, you know, right. And I walked in three questions in there, like looking at me, like, I’m speaking Greek. And it’s like, oh, wait, you don’t have this figured out? Like, oh, wait a second, you’re like me, like, we’re all screwed up. We can help each other here. You know? And I think, especially for people who are earlier on, yeah, so many of my conversations, people feel like they’ve hit this kind of existential wall. There’s something just fundamentally flawed about me or my business model, or like something that can’t be changed, right? And it’s this very kind of fatalistic thing. But the reality of it is, there’s like, when you look at you, you know, sitting in the chair being coached, versus this other person who has the success that you want, the things that we see that are different are just the symptoms of the process, right, and a function of time for many of them. And I found more than anything, and you brought this up multiple times, you said, every single one of these stages requires faith. And I couldn’t agree more like there has to be a conviction that this is what you’re going for. Yes. Yes. And so I love that you drew that out, because I think there’s this constant desire. And so, specifically for founders, entrepreneurs, there’s this desire to control, right? We want to be in control, right? We want to reach a stage where we’re not dependent on faith. Right, haven’t found it yet. Have you?
Shae Bynes
Good luck with that. And the thing is, even if you think you found that the problem with that is that then you have to maintain that yourself. When you block and up and fade and in surrender and openness. You don’t have to maintain that you don’t have to bear the weight of it. And that is a game changer. That’s a game changer. Yeah.
Scott Ritzheimer
So if we were to drill in on that kind of last year But you mentioned this season group. I think one of the unique challenges even though we’ve talked a lot about how it’s internal, one of the unique challenges that that group basis is that there’s now something to lose. Right? When you’re in startup mode, if it doesn’t work, like you don’t even have no one even knows that you are going to start it. Again, and I don’t want to take away from that, because it’s a painful process of a dream dies, or if a business plan doesn’t work out like that, that’s a really painful process. But we become even more acutely aware of that once we actually have something that’s working, we have a reputation, right? We’ve been on all the podcasts or we you know, we’ve had the spotlight in the local business paper, whatever it may be people know about us, maybe you’ve even it’s just your clients, we’ve got a balance sheet, we’ve got employees who are now depending on us. And for all intents and purposes, we can keep doing what we’re doing, and everyone will be pretty comfortable. But then you you get this, you know, thing inside this call, right to expand or to pivot? And it doesn’t seem like it should be but I would I think it’s almost more scary than the the first call to start. Yeah,
Shae Bynes
I think I think that’s probably true for a lot of people because of the circumstances in which you mentioned, which is that there’s already something here that’s established, you know, so Oh, so what is this going to look like? It’s all what are they going to think? What if this happens? What if this whole thing falls apart? Because I do this part, or you know, that type of thing, which is again, why it’s like faith. But what’s cool about it about these stages, though, is that you have this Why believe it’s so important to track your history. Because when you track your history, then you realize it’s like, no, no, like, even though this looks new, I’m not the same, right? Everything’s, you know, it’s like there’s all these things that have been built upon from each stage along the way. And all of that is valuable, has equipped you has given you experiences give you gumption has given you whatever the things that it’s needed to take that next step. But one of the things that I think is super freeing for people, I say this all the time, like God is a source, everyone and everything else is a resource. So if you keep that perspective, and people listening might have different faith backgrounds, or whatever. But if you believe in someone higher than yourself, then it’s like that, if you say this is my source, and not only my source, but the source of those who are working for me the source of the people who are who are customers potential because the source, I am simply a resource, it puts you in the proper posture for you not to take on more than you’re supposed to in the first place. Right? It keeps you in that perspective, and it keeps you open. Because I go back to that partnership, right? It’s not all about you, and it’s not all riding on you. And I think that’s an important thing for people to understand. It’s also a freeing thing to understand. That’s why I wrote this book, Grace over grind, right? How grace will take your business where grinding can, The grind is like, I’m gonna do this thing on my own strength, I can make all the things happen. And when you think that way, and you function that way, then when it’s time and you’re you’re you’re further along, you feel that weight even more, the little bit of weight that you felt when you started, if you’re just like, this is grind is all about what I can do, I’m on to sleep, I’m gonna make this happen, I’m gonna do this thing in my own strength, I’m approved such and such wrong, whatever, the further along you go the weightier that becomes. Yeah, so that’s why the freedom is in the surrender of the truth that I’m not the source of this. And I’m not the source of these people, either. Yeah, I’m a resource. So let’s like, have a proper perspective on this, and then navigate it along the way, right? There’s something very freeing around that.
Scott Ritzheimer
It’s so good. I would say if, if you’re a founder or leader, I want to just want to piggyback on what you said here. But if you’re a founder, leader, and you think you’re the source of success in your business, right, you have already started limiting the growth.
Shae Bynes
Yeah. Facts!
Scott Ritzheimer
Alright, so here we go. This is the moment I’ve been waiting for. I know our audience has been expecting it. They know it’s coming. They want it. Let’s give the people what they want. Tell us what is the biggest secret that you wish wasn’t a secret? What’s the one thing that you wish everyone listening knew today?
Shae Bynes
That there is an invitation from God to do business with him?
I think a lot of people regardless of you know, whatever faith upbringing, they have, you know, whatever that looks like, I think that I know this was a missing piece for me, too, is even if I said, Oh, I want to do this, you know, to to represent God well or to the glory of God or whatever. That’s not that’s not really what it’s all about either. There’s actually an invitation do when there’s actually strategy and site provision based Ever all this goodness, when you actually do business with God is why that’s what we that’s what we why we help people to do that to partner with God. What does that even look like a lot of people don’t even know that’s a thing. I didn’t know it was a thing. But But now having accepted that invitation, I’ve experienced the most wild and crazy and amazing adventure in my life over the last decade. Right. And so that’s what I wish more people knew the secret that shouldn’t be a secret, because it’s just true. Yeah, that’s so
Scott Ritzheimer
good. One time I heard someone say that it what you’re talking about the difference between doing something for God and doing something with God?
Shae Bynes
Yeah, huge difference, like, huge difference.
Scott Ritzheimer
And if you’re sitting there listening, and you’re thinking like, what does that like mean? Go check out Kingdom driven entrepreneur podcast, because basically, every single episode is that story again, and again and again, is because I know that that’s exactly what we talked about whenever I was on your show a little while back. So I would strongly recommend it’s a brilliant podcast. You’re a wonderful host. And and so anyone who’s looking for just another amazing podcast is absolutely when you should check out again, Kingdom driven entrepreneur. So all right, here we go. What I’d like to do, I’m going to shift gears on you a little bit, have you take off your your advisor hat, right, your inspira hat for a moment, and I’m gonna have you put on your founder hat because I know, your founder of the organization, you let me know, just before that you’ve transitioned out of the CEO seat. So this is
Shae Bynes
what happened in November 2020. Yes, so
Scott Ritzheimer
exciting. All right. So given that and given, you know, kind of your world right now, wearing your founder hat your leader in and of your own right, what does the next stage of growth look like for you?
Shae Bynes
So, we you transition out of the CEO seat. So process, man, because I’m the CEO happens to be my husband. So I actually have that relational dynamic, which actually probably helped in some ways. But it was an interesting pivot that I still feel like I’m in the process of, because I’ve been doing a thing and a particular lane and a particular position for so many years. And then I’m having to rediscover the now well, what what is it now that I’m supposed to be focused in on and what does that look like? You know, we talked about on the front, and I said, I call it a glory to glory. And you’re like, Yeah, that’s the most optimistic way I’ve ever, you know, heard it said, but I’m actually in that process right now. Because there’s things that I have vision around that he’s given me that I don’t have the experience around. And then there’s other things that I can see where the experiences of the last decade absolutely equipped me for it. But yet, there’s still so much that I don’t know, again, so much. So I feel like after year 10, I feel like from a growth perspective, I knew I was at the place where I knew this is, this is why we’re here. This is what we do. Here’s how this is thriving. Now. Here’s where we’re headed, to now.
So what are we doing now? And what does that look like? And that has absolutely been a stretch along with now, this will be different for many people. Because some people when they shift out of let’s say, a founder seat, they may or may not even be involved in the company anymore. For me, I have a role still. And figuring out how to navigate that has been a several month process of how do you release as much as you need to release but be as present as you need to be in the position that you need to be walking in right now, while simultaneously doing the things that are the new things that God’s called you into, right. And so that is my current stretch. It has been my stretch since for the last year and a half. And it continues to be my stretch. It really does. But I’m starting to like instead of feeling like at the end of 2020, it felt like and then maybe midway of last year, it felt like okay, I’m starting to figure things out a little bit. And now I’m to the point of I’m excited. I’m at the stage of now I’m excited and in great anticipation for moving into you know, these next few months into the next year. But it’s been a process Scott,
Scott Ritzheimer
It sure is that I actually so there’s a model that I use in my team uses is called the founders evolution and again, a Maps these different stages for the individual themselves. Yeah. And stage five being CEO to stage six true owner. Is that that question? And for each of the stages of founders kind of one defining question. And the defining question that I found for that stage six is Who Am I? Yes. Because you aren’t Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur anymore, right.
Shae Bynes
I need to figure out well, who’s Shae Bynes showing up like, because I’ve been showing up as Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur for so long. Yeah. Yeah.
Scott Ritzheimer
And and it’s one of the again That’s one of the things it’s like, you end up and you feel totally out of your depth again. And it’s like IT folks who aren’t there really have trouble kind of like, What do you mean? Who am I like? How did you get to that point and not know who you are? You know, right. And then, you know, eventually, hopefully, they’ll get to that stage one day, and then it’ll hit. But it’s it’s a profound question. And it’s a place where I have seen, especially folks with humility, that if they can address that question with humility and advice from the outside, there, the opportunity to start, the next journey goes through the roof. Absolutely. And the alternative is you go and kind of, you know, do your golf course thing or whatever it is, you know, and it’s, it’s miserable for folks who are wired the way that entrepreneurs are wired.
Shae Bynes
Yeah, no, I’m called to Bill. That’s just who I am. Right? So it’s like, okay, so then what does that look like next? And then how do I steward that? Well, because there’s a bunch of stuff again, that I’m like, Oh, I don’t have experience in that. But it’s like, but I’ve walked this out for so long. Now. This like I can, going back to that history, tracking the history that I can be like, Ah, okay, well, this is informing this future. Now, I’ve gone through this. I’ve seen your faithfulness in this area. I’ve seen how he walked this out. Okay, so I’m just gonna do it again. You know, and it’s like, and I could do that, knowing who I am. But the assignment has changed, right? It’s like, I feel very confident in who I am. But because the assignment has changed. And also from a communication perspective, people have to receive me as more than founder of Kingdom driven entrepreneur, what does that look like? How do I express that? You know? And so that’s been part of the I mean, simple stuff. Like if I’m doing an interview, like the one with you right now, do I send them to Kingdom driven entrepreneur.com? Do I send finds out kind of like, literally, like, those are the types of things that I have to navigate? I really do?
Scott Ritzheimer
Well, I’m gonna put you on the spot, because that’s my question. So I’m so I just hit him square between the shoulders and I’m right in the chest. And they’re saying yes, like, I do want to step out in faith, I do want to do this work with God, I am the source of my business. And I don’t want to be that or at least I feel that way. So what URL do they go to?
Shae Bynes
I’m going to recommend that they go to http://kingdomdrivenentrepreneur.com/12questions/, as well question the number one, two questions. The reason why I recommend that is because it is a great resource that’s going to get you in that beginning stage of engaging gap from a partnership perspective and business people like what does that look like? Practically, this is a tool that I helped you to begin just a step out and practicing something new, you know, as it relates to your business so that you can realize that you can do business with the actual source and be an effective resource.
Scott Ritzheimer
It’s so good. So http://kingdomdrivenentrepreneur.com/12questions/. Well, wonderful. Shay, thank you so much for being here. I greatly appreciate it. It was a wonderful conversation.
Shae Bynes
Thanks for having me. It was fun!
Scott Ritzheimer
Absolutely. And for everyone listening your time and attention mean the absolute world to us. Thank you so much for for spending your time with us today. And we I hope that you got as much out of this conversation as I did, and I look forward to seeing you next week. Take care.
Contact Guest Name
You can learn more about Shae and the Kingdom Driven Entrepreneur movement at https://www.kingdomdrivenentrepreneur.com/12questions or check out our conversation on her podcast here.